KIKO'S HOUSE: Quotes du Jour on the War

Thursday, February 08, 2007

Quotes du Jour on the War

My guess is that history will say that the forces that we liberated by invading Iraq were so powerful and so uncontrollable that virtually nothing the United States might have done, except to impose its own repressive state with half a million troops, which might have had to last ten years or more, nothing we could have done would have effectively prevented this disintegration that is now occurring.

-- JOHN BURNS

There’s no doubt in my mind that the dialogue here in Washington strengthens our democracy. Period. [Potential enemies may take some comfort from the rancor] but they don’t have a clue how democracy works.

-- GENERAL PETER PACE

The American belief is, that enough factions (there are several dozen factions) on all sides (there are over a dozen different wars going on) are beaten down sufficiently, they will accept a ceasefire and peace. That's not an end to the war, just as the 1990 Lebanese peace deal (ending fifteen years of violence) is about to be revoked. The Israelis and Palestinians have been going at it for decades. The Yemeni civil war is almost as old. Most Iraqis want peace, and the belief is that killing a few more of those who don't will make it happen, at least for a while.

-- STRATEGY PAGE

Photograph by Karim Kadim/The Associated Press

3 comments:

cognitorex said...: John Burns' Revisionist Whitewash Comments Took My Breath Away

"My guess is that ..the forces that we liberated by invading Iraq were so powerful and so uncontrollable that virtually nothing the United States might have done,...would have effectively prevented this (present) disintegration."

The Generals were forbade from writing a comprehensive post war plan under threat of being fired.
The State Department's 15 Volume post-war plan and analysis was effectively trashed.

Since day one of the Iraq fiasco my mind frequently offers up what I call the "Einstein Exception." All time is relative. Whether the mission in Iraq was to install a friendly government by force thusly cementing a US presence in hydrocarbon central or to vanquish a threatening regime it makes no difference. What makes a difference is that the amount of time available to plan a successful liberation was in no way constrained. The speed at which the invasion was executed, which precluded comprehensive post-war planning, was itself the greatest element of incompetence.
I strongly argue that John Burns' argument is therefore null and void.

(reference below to post war planning debate)

RUMSFELD FORBADE PLANS FOR POST WAR IRAQ
.
Original news report, Daily Press, Virginia.

Paraphrased, General Scheid said that preparing a Phase 4 Plan as to handling the aftermath of defeating Saddam was not allowed, not even to be discussed on punishment of being "fired."
A Phase 4 Plan would have tipped Congress and the public that Iraq would be or could be a very murderous multi-year extended engagement. Rhummy et al apparently considered that they could only tell the voters more palatable news that we would be warmly welcomed and that it would be a short engagement if no one planned for or was even allowed to outline the obvious and known probable downside contingencies.
The message, again paraphrased, was "Shinseki's honest estimate of troop needs and all normal post occupation planning are (to use a good fascist word) verboten. The lie that the Iraq mission will be easy, complete with flowers from the liberated, will be sold to the public and we do not want any negative scenario planning documents to see the light of day."
"The book "Assassin's Gate" tells the same story, i.e. that the State Department could not get a direct charge for preparing a post invasion plan and what was prepared by way of Phase 4 by the Army, de facto, never saw the light of day.
To summarize: the leadership of the United States prevented our entire Military and each and every one of our now dead or disabled troops the benefit of a normal, complete and required invasion plan in order that their hyped story for the public would not be subject to "smoking gun" evidence that they fully knew of the issues embodied in the maelstrom of post invasion Iraq.
Thousands of our troops and tens of thousand Iraqis are now dead in the service of deliberate and malicious lies. I can not remotely imagine the searing anger and bitterness a parent might feel if their child was now dead due to this act of calculated incompetence.; 12:25 PM
Shaun Mullen said...: Hi Coggy:

I'm betwixt and between on this one. You are correct, but I think Burns would agree with you in a discussion more expansive than the sound bite that I quoted.

Burns is simply one of the best there is and will be sorely missed in Iraq. (He's moving to London later in the year.); 12:29 PM
cognitorex said...: How nimbly you walked that tightrope my friend. Your sagacious agility is duly noted. PS I blogged my response to your quote here and there, hat tip Shaun, thanks.; 3:42 PM